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Railways, trams, buses, etc.
Cardiarms
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Postby Cardiarms » Thu 01 Mar, 2012 2:20 pm

Well I need a filling but I don't think that's what you're asking!

I was wondering if the red and black plans could be overlaid on e each other to identify the differences and if the red plan could be put on the current google view to see how it lines up.

Thanks - good luck - I hate the dentist.
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liits
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Postby liits » Thu 01 Mar, 2012 3:04 pm

No probs. The "Black" plan I've extracted already, the red one won't take more then an hour.
The lining up on Google Earth is where I was adrift on the last attempt.
Has the station above been extended to the south beyond the limit shown on the black plan?
jim
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Postby jim » Thu 01 Mar, 2012 4:20 pm

liits wrote:
Has the station above been extended to the south beyond the limit shown on the black plan?


Hi liits. Yes, the station perimeter boundary was extended by the width of at least two tracks (and the spaces between them of course!) when the 1891 rebuild took place. This can be demonstrated by the very short lengths of the arches south of Dark Neville Street as shown on the "black" plan, compared with what is to be seen now, which has remained unchanged since that rebuilding.

I would imagine the difference is of the order of 20-30 feet.
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buffaloskinner
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Postby buffaloskinner » Thu 01 Mar, 2012 7:39 pm

Hopefully this shots the Kings Mill stone a little better



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Jogon
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Postby Jogon » Thu 01 Mar, 2012 8:09 pm

Never seen that or knew of Mill. Youngsters will assume it's an old Bread Advert, not far wrong.

Phill_dvsn
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Postby Phill_dvsn » Thu 01 Mar, 2012 8:26 pm

I've edited your photo a little Buffalo just get a clearer look.



It certainly looks very old to me. and the brickwork around it is old too. In fact it looks a bodge job and not brickwork you would see if it had been placed there during recent renovation of the area.

I'm wondering if that stone and brickwork was done when the mill was knocked down in 1913.
It would be good to get a date when the goit was finally taken out of use and filled in.

It's a shame the vegetation is hiding it too, lets hope someone from the Council reads up on S.L and the necessary gets done!    
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liits
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Postby liits » Thu 01 Mar, 2012 8:28 pm

Now I can see why you should never scale anything from drawings. The red and the black plans are wildly different. No amount of tinkering will get them to overlay exactly without distorting either of the original plans.
Obviously, they are drawn by different people but I’m guessing that the subject was measured differently too.
So, while keeping to the constraints of the obvious datums of the outside walls / perimeters, here’s red plan overlain on the black plan.


Or click on the link below for a very large version.
http://tinyurl.com/6m46ncp

The overlay onto Google Earth may have to wait a few hours.    
Tasa
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Postby Tasa » Thu 01 Mar, 2012 8:43 pm

buffaloskinner, thanks for taking the trouble to photograph this (and to Phill for the extra editing so that it could be viewed closer). I'm now convinced that this is an old stone, not placed at the time of the waterfront regeneration.

lüts, I would love to be able to overlay maps like you do. I have a feeling that you've mentioned on another thread in the forum how you do it, but I'm not sure what to search for. Could you point me in the right direction? Thanks Regular Smiley

jim
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Postby jim » Thu 01 Mar, 2012 9:59 pm

A very fine superimposition job liits. Many thanks.

The large scale version is sufficient to convince me that the "black" plan shows that in every essential - bar the southern boundary extension strip - the basic configuration of the arch layout that I knew intimately - no sniggering at the back! - from 1958 to 1995 when I took early retirement. There were minor opening wallings-up, and one or two doorways knocked through, but I am confident that the basic configuration continues to this day.

The "red" plan is another matter, however. There are serious discrepancies, which I don't think can be explained by the 1874 extensions, and would persist in regarding the "red" plan to be an early proposal that was replaced by a rethink when actually built as th first version of Leeds New.

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Leodian
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Postby Leodian » Thu 01 Mar, 2012 10:51 pm

In my post yesterday at 22:01:30 I referred to a photo of mine that was the subject of a thread I posted on December 14 2011, namely http://www.secretleeds.co.uk/forum/Messages.aspx?ThreadID=3540

In my post yesterday I wondered if the small building seen in it could be hiding any signs of old structure? Just looking at that photo again I noticed there is some odd looking stone work that is very roughly arch shaped below the road/footway bridge. It may just be perhaps renovation work done at some stage but in view of the mentions of tram like tracks I wonder if there was anything there at one time. One thing noticeable in the photo (which I have put with this post) are the several differing types of stone work seen.
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